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Need some meds info

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Need some meds info

Post  pugmom on 2/24/2012, 10:12 pm

I recently started giving my pug, Ty something called Pain Away. A joint and back pain relief. The ingredients are MSM 500mg, Glucosamine Sulfate 500mg, Boswellia Extract 65% 500mg, and Devil Claw Root 500mg. I give 1/2 a teaspoon a day on Ty's kibble. According to the directions. I give him 1/4 teaspoon on each meal. I bought this at my local pet products store. He carries only the best of dog food. Has a whole row of frozen products and many holistic type products in his shop.

I also give Ty 1/2 a tablet of Arthogen plus. (which I have to order on-line) The Arthogen ingrediants are Glucosamine HCI 500mg, Methylsufonylmethane MSM 250 mg, chrondroitin sulphate 200mg, Vitamin C 33mg, Hyaluronic Acid (HA)20 mg and Maganese ascorbate 5mg and some other ingredients flavoring, maltodextrin brewers yeast, cellulose, and silicon dioxide. (all 100% human grage ingredients)

My question is, do you think I am giving Ty too much MSM and Glucosamine? Is there a limit as to how much should be given?

Or is this something only my vet will be able to answer? After I show him both products. Ty will be due for a check-up in May.



Ty's age is not known but as far as we can tell he is at least 13 years old. Walks extremely slow with a slight humped back and tail down. The only time Ty's tail comes up is when he knows his food dish is coming and as he greets us when we come home. His sight is extremely limited and he cannot hear. Also has very few teeth left. I know his mouth hurts him at times as he winces when I use PetzLife on his few teeth.
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Re: Need some meds info

Post  thminis on 2/25/2012, 12:34 am

I'm not exactly sure about the dosage, but I would worry more that glucosamine and MSM aren't actual pain reducers. Glucosamine is one of the few supplements that does have actual research supporting it (the brand Cosequin I believe has done a lot), but the research shows in increase in flexibility in joint tissues and repair of. So while it is great to have him on it long term, commonly you won't see results right away, and if you do, it's not pain control.

It sounds like you may be against a more "western" anti inflammatory like Rimadyl or Tramadol or something else, but I've seen both do absolute wonders for geriatric painful pets. They're given along with a joint supplement.

I'll check out Reggie's bottle and see how much of glucosamine and chondroiten he gets daily.
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thminis
 
 

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Re: Need some meds info

Post  DappleDoxieStaff on 2/25/2012, 1:12 am

MSM is an antiinflammitory ... and as such aids with pain
Glucosamine is comprised of a sugar and an amino acid (glutamine) to make hyaluronan - part of synovial fluid. Chondroitin is a component of cartilage, and MSM is Methylsulfonylmethane - it gives sulfur for binding cellular components and makes cells permeable. <<-- there is more, but I am sleepy
There are minimum amounts that are recommended - but since everything is building blocks of the body's systems ... difficult to overdose. The body will simply eliminate what it does not use.
Joke in the medical field is that people taking massive dietary supplements (vitamins and such) have the most expensive urine in the population
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Re: Need some meds info

Post  thminis on 2/25/2012, 2:34 am

Agreed about the body ridding of any excess vitamins and such (IE when people load up on Vitamin C when they feel sick...your body just excretes any excess). To my knowledge, this is true for water soluble vitamins. Fat soluble you can "overdose" on (I believe A, D, E, and K) and obtain toxic levels.

I did not know MSM was an anti inflammatory. Good to know.

I took an Equine Nutrition class a year or so ago where we all had pick a supplement (or nutraceutical) and give a report. Our professor just kept drilling it into our heads that unfortunately, the more holistic route doesn't have the science behind it yet (exception is glucosamine and chondroitin. This is TOTALLY okay and no reason not to use supplements and such, but if it's a quality of life issue, sometimes there isn't time to try something that may or may not work.

If you are seeing results with the supplements, then that's awesome and keep with it. Omega 3 (like fish oil supplements) are also natural anti inflammatories.
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thminis
 
 

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Re: Need some meds info

Post  DappleDoxieStaff on 2/25/2012, 2:40 am

**Fat soluble you can "overdose" on (I believe A, D, E, and K) and obtain toxic levels.**

Always, always forget about those! Blonde moment ;-)
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Re: Need some meds info

Post  pugmom on 2/25/2012, 1:37 pm

Thank you so much for the above information. I just knew that you all would come through. This helps a lot.

I have been giving Ty the Arthogen for four years ever since I got him. The Pain Away I started just two months ago. Although Ty is old I feel that in the four years I have had him, he is better off now than when I first got him.

I have used Neo/Poly/Dex in his eyes twice a day since the day I first took him to the vet. His eyes are no better but thankfully no worse than four years ago.
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Re: Need some meds info

Post  Renee on 2/25/2012, 2:04 pm

I have to agree here with Theresa, I do not believe you can 'overdose' on glucosamine. I give it to my pug Ichiro. And, he gets twice the recommended dosage.

As for pain, I think you may see some positive results with trying something a little stronger, like rimadyl or tramadol. I would recommend getting a few from your vet, try it once daily (or whatever the dosage is) for a week, and see what you think. Sometimes dogs are so good at hiding pain. We have no clue anything is hurting, until you see them on pain meds and off, and then you get a comparison.
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Re: Need some meds info

Post  Pugsaunt on 2/25/2012, 5:22 pm

Penny gets glucosamine/chondroitin/MSM every day, and 1/2 Tramadol twice a day. She also gets Metacam, an anti-inflammatory that is easier on the liver than Rimadyl, and has been a miracle drug for her. I can see a difference when I run out of Metacam in two days.
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