Squirt Bottle Good or Bad in your opinion?

So, while we love our little Happy something fierce, he is not without his (sometimes many) challenges! lol
The biggest one by far as I have 2 toddlers is the biting! He's a puppy so I get that's it's normal, but after trying every single (kind, no hitting or anything like that ever!) method, we gave him a little squirt with a water bottle on his back leg and presto!! We immediately owned a completely different puppy!

It had gotten to the point where the kids and Happy just couldn't be in the same room together as their energy levels would just set each other off and craziness would ensue, and Happy was CONSTANTLY trying to bite them (playfully, but to a 1.5 year old those puppy teeth hurt)! Since introducing the water bottle, the kids and Happy can play together, and they do! Bouncing and running all over the place. As soon as Happy gets nippy I give him a little squirt and he immediately backs off.

Here's my concern. AI dog-trainer friend of my husband's was horrified that we were doing this and advised us to stop immediately, stating we were ruining all trust the puppy has in us etc etc.

Thoughts?
It really seems to be working, and Happy doesn't SEEM traumatized, it just sort of snaps him out of the biting at the moment, he just picks up and continues playing, but without his teeth!

I guess I'm looking for reassurance! lol

The following is an article on teaching bite inhibition. And I'll come out of the training closet and say that I'm not much of a fan of the squirt bottle. I use it VERY rarely and only as an absolute last resort to bust up behvaiour that MUST be stopped--like a dog fight. It's easy to over use it. Especially in a puppy that young. I don't think it's hugely damaging to a dog, to be honest, but I'm not sure that your little one will "get it" entirely. And I worry with pups that young that what they are learning isn't bite inhibition, but "Going near the kids is a bad thing". I don't know how folks with little kids and puppies do it. I could handle one or the other, but not a puppy and toddlers.

Teaching Bite Inhibition
Please read this section extremely
carefully. I shall repeat over and over: teaching bite inhibition is
the most important aspect of your puppy's entire education.
Certainly
puppy biting behavior must eventually be eliminated. We cannot have an
adult dog playfully mauling family, friends, and strangers in the
manner of a young puppy. However, it is essential that this be done
gradually and progressively via a systematic two-step process: first,
to inhibit the force of puppy bites and second, to lessen the frequency
of puppy mouthing.
Ideally, the two phases should be taught in
sequence, but with more active puppy biters you may wish to work on
both stages at the same time. In either case, you must teach your puppy
to bite or mouth gently before puppy biting behavior is eliminated
altogether
Inhibiting the Force of Bites
The first step is to
stop your puppy from hurting people: to teach him to inhibit the force
of his play-bites. Physical punishments are certainly not called for.
But it is essential to let your puppy know that bites can hurt. A
simple "Ouch!" is usually sufficient. When the puppy backs off, take a
short time-out to "lick your wounds," instruct your pup to come, sit,
and lie down to apologize and make up and then, resume playing. If your
puppy does not respond to your yelp by easing up or backing off, an
effective technique is to call the puppy a "Bully!" and then leave the
room and shut the door. Allow the pup a minute or two time-out to
reflect on the association between his painful bite and the immediate
departure of his favorite human playmate. Then return to make up. It is
important to show that you still love your puppy, only that his painful
bites are objectionable. Have your pup come and sit and then resume
playing once more.
It is much better for you to walk away from the
pup than to physically restrain him or remove him to his confinement
area at a time when he is biting too hard. So make a habit of playing
with your puppy in his long-term confinement area. This technique is
remarkably effective with lead-headed dogs, since it is precisely the
way puppies learn to inhibit the force of their bites when playing with
each other. If one puppy bites another too hard, the bitee yelps and
playing is postponed while he licks his wounds. The biter soon learns
that hard bites interrupt an otherwise enjoyable play session. He
learns to bite more softly once play resumes.
The next step is to
eliminate bite pressure entirely, even though the "bites" no longer
hurt. While your puppy is chewing his human chewtoy, wait for a bite
that is harder than the rest and respond as if it really hurt, even
though it didn't: "Ouch, you worm! Gennntly! That really hurt me, you
bully!" Your puppy begins to think, "Good Heavens! These humans are
soooooo sensitive. I'll have to be really careful when mouthing their
delicate skin." And that's precisely what you want your pup to think:
that he needs to be extremely careful and gentle when playing with
people.
Your pup should learn not to hurt people well before he is
three months old. Ideally, by the time he is four-and-a-half months old
— before he develops strong jaws and adult canine teeth — he should no
longer be exerting any pressure when mouthing.
Decreasing the Frequency of Mouthing
Once
your puppy has been taught to mouth gently, it is time to reduce the
frequency of mouthing. Your pup must learn that mouthing is okay, but
he must stop when requested. Why? Because it is inconvenient to drink a
cup of tea or to answer the telephone with fifty pounds of wriggling
pup dangling from your wrist. That's why.
It is better to first
teach "Off" using food as both a distraction and a reward. The deal is
this: once I say "Off," if you don't touch the food treat in my hand
for just one second, I'll say, "Take it" and you can have it. Once your
pup has mastered this simple task, up the ante to two or three seconds
of non-contact, and then to five, eight, twelve, twenty, and so on.
Count out the seconds and praise the dog with each second: "Good dog
one, good dog two, good dog three," and so forth. If the pup touches
the treat before you are ready to give it, simply start the count from
zero again. Your pup quickly learns that once you say "Off," he can not
have the treat until he has not touched it, for, say, eight seconds, so
the quickest way to get the treat is not to touch it for the first
eight seconds. In addition, regular hand-feeding during this exercise
encourages your pup's soft mouth.
Once your pup understands the
"Off" request, use food as a lure and a reward to teach it to let go
when mouthing. Say, "Off" and waggle some food as a lure to entice your
pup to let go and sit. Then praise the pup and give the food as a
reward when he does so.
The main point of this exercise is to
practice stopping the pup from mouthing, and so each time your puppy
obediently ceases and desists, resume playing once more. Stop and start
the session many times over. Also, since the puppy wants to mouth, the
best reward for stopping mouthing is to allow him to mouth again. When
you decide to stop the mouthing session altogether, say, "Off" and then
offer your puppy a Kong stuffed with kibble.
If ever your pup
refuses to release your hand when requested, say, "Bully!" rapidly
extricate your hand from his mouth, and storm out of the room mumbling,
"Right. That's done it! You've ruined it! Finished! Over! No more!" and
shut the door in his face. Give the pup a couple of minutes on his own
to reflect on his loss and then go back to call him to come and sit and
make up before continuing the mouthing game.
By the time your pup is
five months old, he must have a mouth as soft and reliable as a
fourteen-year-old working Labrador Retriever: your puppy should never
initiate mouthing unless requested; he should never exert any pressure
when mouthing; and he should stop mouthing and calm down immediately
upon request by any family member.
Whether or not you allow your
adult dog to mouth on request is up to you. For most owners, I
recommend that they teach their dog to discontinue mouthing people
altogether by the time he is six to eight months old. However, it is
essential to continue bite inhibition exercises. Otherwise, your dog's
bite will begin to drift and become harder as he grows older. It is
important to regularly handfeed your dog and clean his teeth each day,
since these exercises involve a human hand in his mouth.
For
owners who have good control over their dog, there is no better way to
maintain the dog's soft mouth than by regular play-fighting. However,
to prevent your puppy from getting out of control and to fully realize
the many benefits of play-fighting, you must play by the rules and
teach your dog to play by the rules.
Play-fighting teaches your
puppy to mouth only hands, which are extremely sensitive to pressure,
but never clothing. Shoelaces, ties, trousers, and hair have no nerves
and cannot feel. Therefore you cannot provide the necessary feedback
when your pup begins to mouth too hard and too close to your skin. The
play-fighting game also teaches your dog that he must adhere to rules
regarding his jaws, regardless of how worked up he may be. Basically,
play-fighting gives you the opportunity to practice controlling your
puppy when he is excited. It is important to establish such control in
a structured setting before real-life situations occur.
Adapted from AFTER You Get Your Puppy by Dr. Ian Dunbar

Thanks for your response!

Although, the only reason we have resorted to the squirt bottle at all is because I have tried for weeks the bite inhibition training just like you have outlined above. Nothing was working! I don't think in Happy's case it is teaching him that to go near kids is bad, as it doesn't stop him in the slightest from playing with them every chance he gets, he simply bites less. We only have to squirt him at most a few times a day.

And yes, I WAS crazy for getting a puppy with toddlers in the house! LOL We are making it work, but it adds a whole other level to crazy around here! I love how much Happy adores them (especially my 18 month old daughter, as she always has a snack in hand and is quite willing to "share") and how much they love him. But boy oh boy is it an insane amount of work! lol

Thank you for your advice though, I do appreciate any and every opinion on the matter!

Part of what you're struggling with, Kristie, is his age. Puppies learn the first important lessons in bite inhibition from their mother and litter mates and he was likely separated from them too early. So he's going to have to learn it from you guys, humans don't teach it as well as other dogs and it's a much slower process.

And here's the deal with puppies--like tiny babies, they don't get it for a long time. They can't learn it yet, their brains aren't sufficiently developed to learn it. And even with a puppy that hasn't been separated from it's mother/litter too early, teaching bite inhibition takes a long time--months--not days or even weeks. Don't be surprised if the squirt bottle stops working. What the squirt bottle does is suppress behaviour rather than train away from it. I would still focus on the training as outlined above and avoid the water bottle unless absolutely necessary.

God knows there are many more harmful ways to stop biting than the squirt bottle, but it's not the best method for a young puppy, in my opinion.

Fair enough, and I thank you for your informative, non judgmental advice! :)

We are definitely still tackling the training process, I should mention that the water bottle is not ALL we are doing, I only use it when the biting is towards my kids and needs to be stopped right away, before I can intervene that second, as my kids, obviously being so young, don't know how to respond appropriately. We are still using time outs when appropriate, and saying "no bite!" and immediately giving him something he IS allowed to chomp on. Sometimes though, even though I never ever leave them alone together, when Happy bites, my kids respond in a way that only makes him crazier. This is only an age issue all around and neither my kids nor my puppy's fault, but I needed a quick method that would make him quickly let go, without hurting or scaring him.

I agree, because we got him too young (which I feel terrible about.) This is perhaps a bit more of an issue than with some puppies. We have seen some progress with Happy over the 6 weeks we have had him, I'm happy to say. And we are trying to only use the water bottle when we need the behaviour to stop that second, otherwise we continue to plod away at the methods you've outlined above. it was just so frustrating to not have my kids allowed to be with their puppy because he was hurting them! I'm hoping we have found a line where he IS being trained, but we have a method to intervene right away if necessary, and hoping that he will be trained appropriately and happily!

After he is done his needles, we want to enroll him in puppy kindergarten too, so hopefully that will go a long way to having a well behaved dog, with well trained owners! lol

Yes, indeed--puppy kindergarten is a GREAT idea. Socialization is so important to the little squirts. And I know that you have your hands full--you have a houseful of toddlers of the two legged and four legged variety. and yes--they do feed off each other's energy--and not always in a good way!

It's one of the reasons that I always discourage people from getting litter mates--they tend to feed off of each other and pay less attention to the owner.

Don't beat yourself up about his age. What's done is done and he will be fine. You just may find that things take a bit longer in terms of training. He doesn't know he's doing wrong and neither do your kids understand that their reactions rev him up. It's just kids and puppies being kids and puppies.

I don't have anything to add to Blanche's great advice. I have a toddler who will be 2 soon and I can only imagine the challenges trying to raise toddler humans with toddler puppies. Lots of time, patience, and consistency. And puppy kindergarten will really help.

I totally agree with Blanche's training advice and I've done everything she said, but I've also used the squirt bottle. Mainly at any sign of aggresion between my two girls or excessive barking. Most of the time I didn't even have to squirt them, just showing the bottle was enough. Now that they're a bit older I haven't needed it for a long time. I don't think I've warped them beyond repair although with Izzy it's hard to tell.

LisaIzzyAggy wrote:I totally agree with Blanche's training advice and I've done everything she said, but I've also used the squirt bottle. Mainly at any sign of aggresion between my two girls or excessive barking. Most of the time I didn't even have to squirt them, just showing the bottle was enough. Now that they're a bit older I haven't needed it for a long time. I don't think I've warped them beyond repair although with Izzy it's hard to tell.

Hee hee. I have a couple of dogs like that--are they just crazy or have I made them that way?
It's more about the age than the method. Squirt bottles on babies is different from a squirt bottle on an adult.

A girl I know had a Tibetan Terrier puppy that would nip her children. They were aged about 6 and 8 and even at that age they were unable to react to the nips in a manner which discouraged them.

I've never used a squirt bottle on mine. Partly because if we are going to be out on a hot day I carry a squirt bottle with me for the purpose of soaking them down and I don't want them thinking that is a punishment.

Means I have to clang saucepans or drop towels on them if a fight is starting to get out of hand.

I think the advice Blanche gave was great to help with the whole biting thing. He is still very young and learning. When my girls were puppies, I kept lots of chew toys around. The puppy nylabones seemed to work for us. If they started biting something they shouldn't or someone, I'd tell them no, get their attention and reward them with a nylabone. I may be lucky but we really lucked out with both our girls. They never chewed on furniture or shoes or people. They would try but I always kept some kind of chew toy around to give them if they did start.

With that being said, I do use a squirt bottle on my girls, mainly for their excessive barking. I do use the word "quiet" and give them a few chances to stop the barking but if it doesn't work, I show them the bottle. It's gotten to the point where I just have to show them the bottle. And if I do have to use it, I squirt them on their backends near their hips.

Yes, I won't deny that I was crazy when getting a puppy at this stage! LOL On the other hand, though, my life is already crazy so I would almost rather get all the craziness over with and hopefully in the next year or 2 maybe I can relax! LOL

I've used it before and didn't have to very much..i don't think he was a fan of surprise water splash to the face, lol....i haven't used it since he was a pupp. He does love water in other forms though...puddles, baths, and hanging out in the water with us in the summer by the lake we camp at

BruceLee33 wrote:I've used it before and didn't have to very much..i don't think he was a fan of surprise water splash to the face, lol....i haven't used it since he was a pupp. He does love water in other forms though...puddles, baths, and hanging out in the water with us in the summer by the lake we camp at

Yes, Happy seems to love water in other forms too! If he is present when I am giving my kids a bath, he is DESPERATE to get in with them. I put him in once, to see what he would do and he LOVED it. I was surprised!!! LOL They are so silly, lol